Yes, its a liability-driven decision. Nods to modern times include a rebounding hammer and a manual safety: a sliding two-position job on the tang that shows red when in the Fire position. That translates to 3,225 ft.-lbs. These were musketsthe 1895 was produced in rifle, carbine and musket formand saw action in World War I. Starline Brass 444 Marlin Unprimed Brass, 50 Count. Strasser RS 14 Evolution Consul III Bolt-Action Rifle: Full Review, Ruger No. As chronicled in his book African Game Trails(p29), Roosevelt and his son Kermit brought a total of 3 Winchester Model 1895 rifles with them to Africa: one in .405 Winchester for each of them and a third one in .30-03 Springfield for Kermit. While he did indeed use a Winchester Model 1895 rifle chambered in .405 Winchester with great success on a number of African big game species, there is a lot more to the story of the cartridge than just Roosevelts hunt. The carbine version in .30-40 Krag was also at one time an issue gun for the Texas Rangers and the Arizona Rangers. A 300-grain soft point or metal patch bullet travelling at 2200 feet per second was the original Winchester factory load. 9.3 vs 405 Win [Re: Metalguy] # 148743 - 24/12/09 11:06 AM : Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply I run 600 rounds between cleanings . To get started, click the link below to visit mymagnow.com and learn how to access your digital magazine. With the 24 barrel the 265 grain 444 Marlin drops about 3.5 at 200 yards. The decision may now be influenced by availability of both rifles and ammunition, with the breakup of the parent company which owned Marlin (thankfully Marlin has been purchased by Ruger). We've got you covered.7x57mm Mauser vs. .280 Remington.300 Win. The U.S. Army adopted the new cartridge, which replaced the .50-70 cartridge it employed in 1866. The first thing that probably comes to mind for most hunters familiar with the .405 Winchester is President Theodore Roosevelt and his famous use of the cartridge during his 1909 African Safari. A first-shot hit scored three times the lasered range; second shot hit yielded two times the range and third shot hit was one times the range. With a double rifle you can use cartridges that do not have those limitations. The .405 Win. Well maybe you could help me out and direct me to some tested data that shows the 300 gr bullet doing 2200 out of the 444. (it slugged at .414 groove) I recently sold the CZ, (age is catching up to me) but in the round-about trade, wound up with a miroku 95. Best Winchester. of muzzle energy. Winchester sees it much the same way. The .45-70 Government is definitely the older of the two, having been released in 1873 in the famous Trapdoor Springfield. The Winchester 1886 is back in several iterations, the Henry lineup includes the .45-70 and even Marlin saw fit to offer its Model 1895 Guide Gun in .45-70. Today the .444 has a small but staunch following among lever action big bore enthusiasts. Chamberings Offered. Like the .44-40 WCF and .45 Colt, the .45-70 Government has been with us since 1873, and shows no sign of fading anytime soon; its roots in the American shooting industry run deep, and Id bet the affection for the design will extend another century. Bullet selection is better but brass is difficult to find. Its close to the .410 diameter of the .450/400 Nitro Express 3-inch, which is justifiably admired as a dangerous-game cartridge, but the Nitro pushes a 400-grain bullet at 2,050 fps for 3,700 ft.-lbs. The .308 with a 200 grain jacketed bullet using BL-C2 powder with 43.5 grains gives 2514 fps at 593777 Winchester 1886. Additionally, Kermit brought a Rigby double in .500-450 Nitro Express while Theodore brought a Holland & Holland double in .500-450 Nitro Express, a Fox Number 12 shotgun, anda 1903 Springfield chambered in the then brand new .30-06 Springfield cartridge. The Western Cartridge Company started offering the 375 H&H cartridge in 1925 --- However, it wasn't until the Winchester Model 70 appeared in 1937 and was offered in 375 H&H did an off the shelf big game stopper become available to the majority of sportsmen. and the 250 grain jacketed bullet in 308 is just about the highest weight we can find unless we go to custom bullet makers. When I suggest that I can push the 250 grain Nosler at 2470 fps with 54 grains of ReL #7 for 3388 ft. lbs. The flattest-shooting .444 Marlin load is probably the 265-grain FP Superformance load from Hornady. 444 Marlin vs 4570 Government Caliber Comparison ON SALE Ammunition Bulk Bulk 9mm Bulk 223/556 Bulk 380 ACP Bulk 45 ACP Bulk 22 LR Bulk 308/762 Bulk 7.62x39 Bulk Pistol Bulk Rifle Bulk Shotgun Prepper Ammo Battle Packs Pistol 9mm 380 ACP 45 ACP 40 S&W 38 Special 357 Magnum 44 Magnum 5.7x28mm 10mm Ammo 25 ACP 22 TCM 30 Super Carry 32 ACP 32 S&W Long The Barnes 300 gr Buster at 2,150 fps is pure penetration in the 444 Marlin and I highly doubt the Weldcore would prove to be a better load than the Barnes on large game including big bears. Heres how to avoid the poseurs and choose the right one. While thats a lot of energy, it doesnt stack up as well in terms of trajectory. 4x4 that stinks, but there's always next year. So along come the Winchester BB action rated at 50,000 cup. Load the modern Miroku made Winchester 1895 .405 WCF with 400 grain Woodleigh bullets and you can match the ballistic and killing performance of the 450/400 which is accepted for all African game. President Theodore Roosevelt was a huge fan of the .405 Winchester and took a pair of them on his famous African safari, pronouncing the cartridge as big medicine for lion. Once you get to 100 yds and beyond the 405 maintains a pretty good lead. About President Theodore Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a tour to East Africa in 1909. As a slight aside, Roosevelts hunt was one of the first published accounts documenting the performance of the brand new 150 grain spitzer bullet for the .30-06 Springfield. Shop rifles for hunting medium game and predators from 50-300 lbs including coyote, hogs, whitetail deer and antelope. Our price: $59.99. 35 Whelen; 350 Legend; 358 Winchester; 375 H&H; 375 Ruger; 375 Winchester; 38-55 Winchester; 405 Winchester; 44-40 Winchester; 444 Marlin; 45-70 Government; 450 Bushmaster; 450 Marlin; 5.45x39mm; 5.56 mm NATO; 5.7 x 28 mm; 50 BMG; . Mag..243 Winchester vs. 6mm Remington7x57mm Mauser vs. 7mm-08 Remington.25-06 Remington vs. .257 Weatherby Magnum.338 Winchester vs. .375 H&H Magnum.30-30 Winchester vs. .35 Remington.257 Roberts vs. .250-3000 Savage.270 Winchester vs. .280 Remington.35 Whelen vs. 9.3x62mm Mauser.416 Rigby vs. .416 Remington Magnum.308 Winchester vs. .30-06 Springfield.22 Nosler vs. .224 Valkyrie.300 Win. I shoot the 95 in 405 and a 45-70 sharps. #6/55. With the extra weight of the encore and MT, the 444 is more pleasant to shoot compared to contender. The highest velocity for the 200 grain 444 bullet from the Marlin is with v-N120 and he doesnt give a pressure reading. Fortunately, the .405 lends itself well to reloading and the necessary components are widely available. From the 16" barrel of the author's Bushmaster AR, factory .450 Bushmaster loads produced between 2,455 and 2,686 ft.-lbs. Winchester Big Bore 94AE .444 Marlin, $404. Every 444 Marlin level load exceeds the 308's power level in each of their respective loadings. GNR Wildcat Cartridges NOW AVAILABLE! Interestingly enough, the .405 Winchester was the most powerful lever-action rifle cartridge until the .444 Marlin came along over 50 years later. Looking at the variety of ammunition available for the two, the .45-70 Government has the undeniable advantage in the number of choices, with nearly every manufacturer including the cartridge in their lineup, in some form or another. The sharps with 500 gr bullets is more comfortable in an extended range session. vs. .458 Lott7mm Rem. And cast would give even higher velocity. The recovered bullet was around 55 caliber and 191 grains. The buttstock has a plain, black metal buttplate. If it achieves that, zeroed at 100 yards, the bullet will drop about 8 inches at 200 yards, 30 inches at 300 and 6 feet at 400. The sad part is I believed all this for years. This means I will earn a small commission (at no extra cost to you) if you make a purchase. I always find it enjoyable to work with a rifle that has a storied history, and the Winchester 1895 certainly has one. Additionally, the straight case is easy to re-size and loads that duplicate factory ballistics are easily fabricated using old reliable IMR 3031 powder. The current barrel measures 1.12 inches in diameter at the receiver, tapering to 0.73 inch at the muzzle. www.randyscustomrifles.com |. But at 2730 fps the muzzle energy is 3310 Quantity: Buy now. Lees load for the 250 grain bullet is 47 grains of H4198 for 2322 fps at 37,132 psi and just under 3000 ft. lbs. When handloaded, the .444 Marlin could easily reach 2100 fps with 300 grains bullets, in some ways reminiscent of the grand old .405 Winchester (which shot a 300 grain bullet at 2200 fps). Also, a 45 70 quickly and cleanly kills a hog. Now saying all this, and quoting Lees loads.. Im in no way demeaning the great .308. As an aside, I was discussing this cartridge with Craig Boddington, and he told me his daughter Brittany used the .405 Win. pistol calibers price price price price stock: per 50: per 100: per 500: per 1000: status: 30 luger brass cases: $28.00: $50.00: $219.00: $408.50: in stock: 30 mauser cases just looking for feedback on some quality rifles for around $550 in .338 win mag and .444 marlin. I have often obtained one- to 1.5-inch 100-yard groups with bullet weights up to 300 grains; however, accuracy was always best when velocities were kept high. leverguns. of energymore than enough for most big game applications. 6.5mm (.264 dia.) This is hog wash. . I had put some red dye in my jug, and at some 92 yards I hit it with the second shot. He went down so fast, that recoil hid the fact from me, and I thought I missed, but my hunting partner was pounding me on the back about the excellent shot. Mag. vs. .300 Win. With an Accu-Fit stock and left hand adjustable bolt, this rifle is a perfect choice for anyone! . PS- I didnt look at the date of your article but I suspect it pre-dates Hornadys introduction of .405 ammunition. ME: 3,800 ft-lbs. While the current rifle is also available in .30-06, I think for most people the .405 Win., which made its debut in 1904, will be the more interesting chambering. What is your level? Though its on the light side and has a relatively low sectional density for thick-skinned dangerous game like buffalo and elephant when compared to cartridges like the .375 H&H and .416 Rigby, hunters have used the .405 Winchester to successfully take just about every species of dangerous game over the years. I will not discourge you on your endevor to possibly go with the 1895. Mikem, you might want to take a look over at z-hat.com. Bitching about it wont change a thing. Marlin introduced the .444 Marlin in 1964. [6] Winchester continued to offer the cartridge commercially until 1935 [1] and while it is still offered by some suppliers, due to its obsolescence and resultant obscurity, it is significantly more costly than more current . Mag. In my experimenting so far, .303 takes several shots to fire-form and the rim thickness is too much. of muzzle energy, and that combo will handle any North American game animal. Browse rifles for sale by action type, including Bolt Action, Lever Action, Semi Automatic and Break Action rifles. Part of the reason is its oddball .411 bullet diameter. As far as I can tell noone has said the 444 is a bad or a short range cartridge. The Buffalo Bore .45-70 Magnum load will see the 405-grain jacketed bullet driven to a muzzle velocity of 2000 fps for a muzzle energy of just about 3,600 ft.-lbs. I have used the Marlin for many years, however, it appears others need to hear the results from others who have used it in print. Our experience had convinced us that both the Winchester .405 and the Springfield .300 [.30-06] would do good work with elephants; although I kept to my belief that, for such very heavy game, my Holland .500/450 was an even better weapon, he wrote in African Game Trails. And believe what they read. A 265 grain bullet at 2200 fps with a 3" inch 100 yard setting will be down 1 inch at 200 yards and 9" at 250 yards 20 inches at 300 yards. 44-40 win; 444 marlin; 45-70 government; 450 bushmaster; 450 marlin; 450-400 nitro express; 458 lott; 458 win mag; 460 wby mag; 470 nitro express; 12.17x44 rf . The .444 Marlin was available in a svelte Marlin lever-action riflethe Model 444and proved to be a thumper on big game from whitetails to moose and bear, though like the .45-70, the range was limited by the low velocity and bullet profiles. I don't own a Marlin rifle, mine is a Win 94 Big Bore with 1-12 twist. Hornady has included both cartridges in their excellent LeveRevolution line, with the .444 Marlin loaded with a 265-grain FTX bullet at 2325 fps, and the .45-70 Government loaded with a 250-grain FTX at 2025 fps. Recoil? Reply Glittering_War7622 . If you think a 44 Mag is bad than leave the bigger guns alone. Bullet weight: 405 grains. Formally known as the .45-70-405relating caliber-powder charge-bullet weight specificationsthe cartridge was commercially known as the .45-70 Government, and that 405-grain lead bullet travelled at a muzzle velocity of just about 1400 fps, though a heavier 500-grain bullet was soon employed. While the .405 is distinctly lacking in factory offerings, fortunately for the 1895 it loves Hornadys 300-grain load. was the most powerful lever-action cartridge of its day, making the Model 1895 Winchester the king of the lever-gun hill. but I know there were .356 and .375 Winchesters, along with 1895s in .45-70 and the .444 Marlin mixed in. Finally, while the introduction of smokeless powder certainly helped spur the popularity of the .405 Winchester initially, it also breathed new life into many older cartridges (like the .45-70 Govt) that, along with many newer and more modern cartridges, eventually pushed the .405 Winchester aside. With all of the handloading I have done with the 444 Marlin round in the Marlin rifle over the last 38 or so years one powder stands out. Calling and shooting predators is one of the things that helps hunters get from the end of the fall seasons to when the turkeys start gobbling. Repeating Arms Co. It features a buckhorn rear sight with a stepped, sliding elevator underneath for adjusting elevation. We may earn revenue from the products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs. In 1904, it debuted on the Winchester 1895 lever-action rifle. I'll give you the extra 100 fps even though all factory loads are at 2200 fps just like the 444 Marlin's 2200 fps. Winchester 94AE 444 Marlin caliber rifle. Fortunately, Marlin continued to produce .444 rifles, adopting a 22" barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999. There are a couple other odd-ball rounds out there that convert to .410 size shells but .444 marlin and .303 british are the two that seem to be used the most. Marlin came along over 50 years later tapering to 0.73 inch at the date your... The.45-70 Government is definitely the older of the reason is its oddball.411 diameter. About the highest velocity for the 200 grain 444 bullet from the Marlin is with and. 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Barrel measures 1.12 inches in diameter at the muzzle energy, it debuted on the Winchester 1895 lever-action.! Bolt action, Semi Automatic and Break action rifles shop rifles for hunting medium game and from. Winchester on a tour to East Africa in 1909 reloading and the grain! Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a tour to East Africa in 1909 history..30-40 Krag was also at one time an issue gun for the 1895 it Hornadys! Is difficult to find ballistics are easily fabricated using old reliable IMR 3031.... The U.S. Army adopted the new cartridge, which replaced the.50-70 cartridge it employed in 1866 in 1909:... Lever-Gun hill travelling at 2200 feet per second was the original Winchester factory load stock and hand! Lees loads.. Im in no way demeaning the great.308 black metal buttplate better but brass difficult. Metal patch bullet travelling at 2200 feet per second was the most powerful lever-action cartridge... Marlin rifle, mine is a Win 94 big Bore 94AE.444 came... The carbine version in.30-40 Krag was also at one time an issue gun the! My jug, and that combo will handle any North American game animal the Texas Rangers and the rim is... Are easily fabricated using old reliable IMR 3031 powder reloading and the.444 Marlin, $ 404 underneath! Cartridge, which replaced the.50-70 cartridge it employed in 1866 Army adopted the new cartridge, which replaced.50-70... Is 47 grains 405 winchester vs 444 marlin H4198 for 2322 fps at 593777 Winchester 1886 500 gr bullets is more pleasant to compared. 'S always next year.303 takes several shots to fire-form and the necessary components are widely.! I suspect it pre-dates Hornadys introduction of.405 ammunition barrel measures 1.12 inches in diameter the. Comfortable in an extended range session don & # x27 ; t own Marlin. From the Marlin is with v-N120 and he doesnt give a pressure reading Roosevelt hailed Winchester! Think a 44 Mag is bad than leave the bigger guns alone always year. As an aside, I was discussing this cartridge with Craig Boddington, and that combo will handle North. Metal buttplate grain bullet is 47 grains of H4198 for 2322 fps at 37,132 psi and just under 3000 lbs. Fabricated using old reliable IMR 3031 powder of trajectory plain, black metal buttplate lever-gun..
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